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#808522 - 04/05/10 08:23 PM Sing It! Mentoring Course for Christan Artists  
Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 4
Naima Offline
Casual Observer
Naima  Offline
Casual Observer

Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 4
Grace and Peace:

The Sing It Girl Master Mind Group For Christian Artists (Yes, we're opening it to the men this time) launches in April. If you want to learn how to take your music ministry to the next level you need to take this class!

You'll learn: how to increase your bookings, develop a marketing and promotions plan, how to build your fan base, the importance of a ministry plan, how to clarify your mission and the importance of your spiritual development - plus so much more!

This is a six month class, and you get:
(6) 70 Minute Class Audio MP3
Course Workbook
(2) 45 Minute One on One Consultations during Months 1 and 4
Unlimited Email Support
Monthly Call In Question and Answer Days
E-Copy of my book: Called To Sing, 13 Mistakes To Avoid When Starting In Music Ministry


For a preview of my teaching style, listen to this free class:

How To Achieve Your God Given Dreams

http://www.instantteleseminar.com/?eventid=10106301

Don't delay, it's time to achieve your calling, to register contact me at naimasbrokenbox@yahoo.com or by calling the office at 615-731-0178.

This class has a monthly fee of $9.99, but scholarships are available.


Thanks so much!

Many Blessings!

#808874 - 04/07/10 03:09 AM Re: Sing It! Mentoring Course for Christan Artists [Re: Naima]  
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 3,065
Michael James Moore Offline
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Michael James Moore  Offline
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Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 3,065
oceanside,CA,USA
That was amazing!!I like to give it all away the most.You really have a cool spirit.Email me your address where to send support for your awesome calling. http://www.mjmrecords.com/

#808881 - 04/07/10 04:05 AM Re: Sing It! Mentoring Course for Christan Artists [Re: Michael James Moore]  
Joined: Sep 2001
Posts: 10,330
Jean Bullock Offline
Jean Bullock  Offline

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I am speechless.


Please visit my facebook EZ3D PopUps for free papercraft templates. Great for beginners of all ages.

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#808930 - 04/07/10 11:23 AM Re: Sing It! Mentoring Course for Christan Artists [Re: Jean Bullock]  
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 7,310
Ray E. Strode Online content
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Ray E. Strode  Online Content
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Joined: May 2001
Posts: 7,310
Brunswick, Ga. USA
Well OK but it sounds like Crass Commericalisim to me. Amen.


Ray E. Strode
#809106 - 04/08/10 08:58 AM Re: Sing It! Mentoring Course for Christan Artists [Re: Ray E. Strode]  
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 8,463
BIG JIM MERRILEES Offline
BIG JIM MERRILEES  Offline

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Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 8,463
Edinburgh, Scotland. UK
Sorry I felt sick listening.....!!!! As an Atheist this typifies MY reasons NOT to follow GOD. This NONESENSE comes from either someone very deluded or a blatant scam artist possibly both. Interested to hear which one applies most. I thought you had to cast away possesions and the greed of capitalism to follow God. Silly me.....

#809133 - 04/08/10 11:13 AM Re: Sing It! Mentoring Course for Christan Artists [Re: BIG JIM MERRILEES]  
Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 4
Naima Offline
Casual Observer
Naima  Offline
Casual Observer

Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 4
Sorry you feel that way. I'm not deluded or a scam artist. I love God and love all people. Music ministry is hard work, and ministry costs money. If we want to feed people we need money to buy food, and that's the point of these classes. I use the money to fund the ministry work. And if it was about commericalism, I wouldn't give away scholarships, I never turn anyone away who does not have the money.

You can visit me at www.naimajohnston.com

God Bless

#809135 - 04/08/10 11:17 AM Re: Sing It! Mentoring Course for Christan Artists [Re: Naima]  
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 10,568
Kevin Emmrich Offline
Kevin Emmrich  Offline


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Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 10,568
Crozet, VA
LOL! That's just Big Jim's way of welcoming you to the JPF. Once he gets to know you, he'll be more open and honest with his criticisms. "Crass Commercialism" -- sounds like a good name for a band.

Welcome to the JPF! I'll try and take some time today to sample your songs.

Kevin

Last edited by Kevin Emmrich; 04/08/10 11:18 AM.

"It's supposed to be hard. If it wasn't hard, everyone would do it. The 'hard' is what makes it great."
Kevin @ bandcamp: Crows Say Vee-Eh (and Kevin @50/90 2019)
#809148 - 04/08/10 11:51 AM Re: Sing It! Mentoring Course for Christan Artists [Re: Kevin Emmrich]  
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 8,463
BIG JIM MERRILEES Offline
BIG JIM MERRILEES  Offline

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Edinburgh, Scotland. UK
Welcome to JPF but Naima I STILL do not get it..... What the hell is music ministry? I listened to your piece and am still none the wiser. I GOOGLED you and on the site I visited it was this for sale and that for sale and enrol in this or enrol in that.....crass commercialism. Why do people have to charge for religion? I watched a TV documentary about some of the old gospel singers and how they extorted shedloads of cash from religious people. Most could make more from gospel than from secular music and most did NOT practice what they preached. A lot outside church were just drunken womanizers. Hypocrisy at its worst. Probably me just being cynical and skeptical. I always am when people say that they hear voices or talk to God and then ask for money.
It is an alien concept for us Brits to see religion and making money go hand in hand.
If Jesus was that clever then he should look after his own properly without them needing to compete in the capitalistic world. LOL

Nothing personal but I just do not understand or agree with this nonsense. It smacks of corruption. I wonder what Jesus would make of it.....JMO.

#809391 - 04/08/10 11:41 PM Re: Sing It! Mentoring Course for Christan Artists [Re: BIG JIM MERRILEES]  
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 53
ChadMac Offline
Helping Hand
ChadMac  Offline
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Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 53
Nashville, TN
Once Big Jim gets to know you, maybe he'll say how he really feels!


#809438 - 04/09/10 05:25 AM Re: Sing It! Mentoring Course for Christan Artists [Re: ChadMac]  
Joined: Sep 2001
Posts: 10,330
Jean Bullock Offline
Jean Bullock  Offline

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Joined: Sep 2001
Posts: 10,330
Anaheim, CA, USA
Well, I guess I am no longer speechless.

I don't have a problem with people in religious occupations getting paid so they can make a living. I am a teacher and a music minister. I get paid so that I can be available to provide a service. If I weren't paid, I could not provide that service because I would have to make a living doing something else. It doesn't matter if I feel "called." Nearly everyone feels "called" to do something they think they would like to do. I was asked to do what I do. I didn't seek it out.

When it comes to serving the religious needs of others, there is a difference between getting reasonably compensated and making a profit off God. I think this is what Jim is referring to.

Somewhere along the way, the Christian "Music Ministry" slipped from reasonable compensation to crass commercialism. Somewhere along the way, so did Religion, Education, Medicine, and everything else.

When it comes to Religion, Medicine, Education and Government, these are the areas that people expect to see some idealism involved. Idealism in these areas still do exist but it's become the exception rather than the rule. On the other hand, integrity, high standards, courtesy, fair play, and other humanistic virtues have generally fallen by the wayside in much of society. Why some people expect virtue in the four areas I mentioned but don't require it of themselves in their own dealings with others is amazing to me. ( I am not speaking of the people here, by the way.) Anyway, these deficiencies are showing up in those four areas because they are a symptom of what is wrong with society as a whole.

Getting to back to the services offered. That is just marketing strategy. It isn't at about God or ministry - it's secular. I would hazard a guess that far more than half the people involved in music "ministry" are not believers. There are a lot of choir directors and church musicians who are not believers and (thankfully) don't pretend to be. They have a degree in music and can't get a job doing anything else. Probably half the people that claim to be believers are fakers, as Jim pointed out.

The "Christian Music" business is just like the rest of the industry. It's a business. It is not a ministry. It is full of people who don't particularly care about spiritual life. It's full of composers, singers, musicians and producers who can't compete in the secular market so they turn to the Christian market for profit making.

To me the offense lies, not so much in offering strategic marketing strategies, but in calling it a ministry. If someone is trying to live the life and if possible would serve in ministry even without being paid, then yes it is a ministry, even if that person is lucky enough to receive compensation in order to live. But ministry doesn't need marketing strategies or fan bases. Especially not fan bases. Music ministry is about God not fan worship. How can one take ministry to a higher level than serving God? There isn't a higher level.

Just call it what it is. Christian Music business strategies.

People can compose, perform, and produce music suitable for worship without pretending to be what they are not. If it's helpful to worshippers, then fine, let them buy the rights to use it.

There is nothing new to this approach. Not all of what we call "Sacred" music was composed by practicing believers. A lot of it was commissioned. Secular composers of the past were in the music business and that is how it was done in the old days.

Just call it what it really is.







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#809446 - 04/09/10 06:40 AM Re: Sing It! Mentoring Course for Christan Artists [Re: Jean Bullock]  
Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 29,275
"Tampa Stan" Good (D) Offline
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"Tampa Stan" Good (D)  Offline
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Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 29,275
Tampa, Florida since 1973
Nicely-Put, Mz Jeannie!

Bein' a Somewhat-Devout Deist, I used to share Big Jim's Viewpoint on Religion-vs-Commercialism...especially as it applied to Christians.

Then..one Christmas back over a Decade-Ago...I met Rev. A. Leon Lowery..when his Beulah Baptist Churchmembers bought him a Grandfather Clock as a gift. (He thought it was "too-ostentatious" & later shipped it to his son, a law-enforcement officer in..think it was Tallahassee..&..bought Another One from us for himself..of Simpler-Design.)

AND..as a result..The Pastor & I became rather Good Friends..for the rest of his life. I invite Jim to Google "Hillsborough Rev. A. Leon Lowery Dies at 92"...where you'll read "Right up until he was admitted to St. Joseph's Hospital with health complications last week, the Rev. Lowery was working as a Chaplain at the Orient Road Jail, getting around by scooter because of hip problems."

"'Among the Last of the Great Civil Rights Leaders in Tampa' former Mayer Sandy Freedman said."

"Among his students, when he taught Theology at Morehouse College, in the 1940's, was Martin Luther King."

Now, IF you Google "Beulah Baptist Church"...you'll find it started off in 1865, when several newly-freed Slaves broke-away from their White Church/started their Own. By 1926, they had "the first Negro Church Choir to sing on a Radio Station in Tampa." (You'll find MUSIC..and Choirs..were Very-Important..to this day...for This Church to continue doing its work..among their Parishioners.) Among the work they do today: Karate & Credit Repair Classes..SAT Training Program...etc-etc.

Pastor Lowry's churchmembers DID give the guy a LOT of Money over the years. BIG New House by the time I met him...(& he later..at age 87..married a VERY-Attractive/Very-YOUNG "Hottie" who I'm sure Raised a Few Eyebrows..But is a Very NICE Person to this day/Why SHOULDN'T someone Good-at-What-He-Does NOT have a Full & Wonderful Life?)

Especially, when, back in the '60s, someone sprayed the front of his house with Gunfire.

Bottom Line for me, Jim, is SOME Christians ARE worth Every Cent they collect from their followers..& not ALL Followers are Ignorant or Gullible Folks.

Peace..& Best Wishes,
Stan

#809460 - 04/09/10 07:27 AM Re: Sing It! Mentoring Course for Christan Artists [Re: ]  
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 8,463
BIG JIM MERRILEES Offline
BIG JIM MERRILEES  Offline

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Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 8,463
Edinburgh, Scotland. UK
Without getting too political or religious....Some people use religion as a scam just to make money......therefore I always am very wary of anyone using hard sell tactics in the same space as religion. The history books are full of scam artists who led a religious life in front of camera and then threw out all the morals and teachings off camera.
Stan...your guy might be all you say he is but sadly there are a lot of people claiming to talk to god who are not quite what they appear to be.
There is a saying that power corrupts and absolute power corrupts absolutely. There is no greater power than religion in some peoples eyes and lets face it most religions have more than a few skeletons hidden in closets.

#809465 - 04/09/10 07:37 AM Re: Sing It! Mentoring Course for Christan Artists [Re: BIG JIM MERRILEES]  
Joined: Sep 2001
Posts: 10,330
Jean Bullock Offline
Jean Bullock  Offline

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Joined: Sep 2001
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Anaheim, CA, USA
A lot of people do, Jim. In a lot of different countries. It's everywhere.


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#809470 - 04/09/10 08:34 AM Re: Sing It! Mentoring Course for Christan Artists [Re: Jean Bullock]  
Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 29,275
"Tampa Stan" Good (D) Offline
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"Tampa Stan" Good (D)  Offline
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Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 29,275
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HI Again, Bro Jimmie!

Hey, Overall, I think I'm still as good a Skeptic as You Are, Amigo! But there still ARE some folks who DO seem to have a pretty Tight-Connection with Whatever's Behind All This.

Are ya gonna condemn Mother Theresa because she was a Catholic?

I'm not..tho I, truthfully, don't care much for The Current Pope. (Bit too-much of the kind of Baggage you just-mentioned.)

Anyways, methinks it's best to Judge Individuals as such...rather than Tar-&-Feathering the entire Batch without doing all the Homework first. Not All Christians take a Vow of Poverty...nor do they really Need-To..JMHO.

Best Wishes Again,
Stan

#809531 - 04/09/10 12:51 PM Re: Sing It! Mentoring Course for Christan Artists [Re: ]  
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 5,129
Marc Barnette Offline
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Marc Barnette  Offline
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Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 5,129
Nashville, Tn.
So we've dived into this one eh? Pretty big pool. you guys have it right on this, and once again, I think Hell is getting distinctly cooler because Big Jim and I are on the same page again! LOL!

My Father came from that world Jim talks about. The Southern Baptist Gospel Quartet world of the late 50's and 60's. One of the reasons he quit was the superficial hypocrisy. Preaching the gospel at night and drinking and carousing after the shows. And the steady stream of fallen angel televangilists, etc. have given us all pause to think.

My particular deal doesn't so much come as people trying to make a living (still have relatives in that business) but their propensity to not pay bills and try to put themselves above everyone else.

The modern Christian music business as it relates to Nashville is called the "Spec" industry. "Speck NOT to get PAID!" They are the last to pay their studio bills, the bills for their busses, the rental on equipment, salaries of employees, and other business expenses. They always claim they are doing "God's work" and it is all "for the ministry." but they seem to have no problem with driving "God's Mercede's, eating on "God's credit card" or using "Other of God's Benefits."

All in how you look at it. As far as this particular product, I am not judging it at all. I am sure it is a fine product and hope it does well and helps people. But as in any product, I suggest to people to check it out, see if it works for you and ASK FOR REFERENCES of people who have used it. If this is a solid product, the owners should have no problem providing some endorsements or verification of how it works.

MAB

#809551 - 04/09/10 02:32 PM Re: Sing It! Mentoring Course for Christan Artists [Re: Marc Barnette]  
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 53
ChadMac Offline
Helping Hand
ChadMac  Offline
Helping Hand

Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 53
Nashville, TN
Marc,

Its not just the Christian music business. I worked in finance for 10 years and it was a long running industry joke that if a Minister ever called for a loan...hang up! They have the worst credit reports of any collective profession. Seemed like a lot of it stemmed from a "The Lord will provide" type attitude instead of doing for yourself.

By the way...welcome to JPF Naima!

Chad

#809576 - 04/09/10 04:29 PM Re: Sing It! Mentoring Course for Christan Artists [Re: ChadMac]  
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 8,463
BIG JIM MERRILEES Offline
BIG JIM MERRILEES  Offline

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Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 8,463
Edinburgh, Scotland. UK
Stan I hear ya and agree with what you say....BUT I would rather be skeptical of religious people or anyone else asking for money till they prove that they are genuine rather than take them at face value and be sorry.
People nowadays are sometimes too trusting......probably the reason so many scammers are succesful.

#809577 - 04/09/10 04:32 PM Re: Sing It! Mentoring Course for Christan Artists [Re: BIG JIM MERRILEES]  
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 8,463
BIG JIM MERRILEES Offline
BIG JIM MERRILEES  Offline

Top 20 Poster

Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 8,463
Edinburgh, Scotland. UK
Hey Marc endorsements are only in the eye of the endorser. LOL

#809703 - 04/10/10 11:49 AM Re: Sing It! Mentoring Course for Christan Artists [Re: BIG JIM MERRILEES]  
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 6,671
Everett Adams Offline
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Everett Adams  Offline
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Joined: Aug 2002
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,NL Canada
Let the wheat and weeds grow up together in the same field, when the harvest takes place, the angels will separate them and put the wheat in the barn (heaven) while the weeds will be burned(hell). Many will say in that day,"I cast out demons in your name" Jesus will say" get thee from me, I never knew you".

There are many under the umbrella of Christianity that are not of Christ, they may fool people but they can't fool God, they give God a bad name. There will be much nashing of teeth on judgement day. Jesus said, "I'd rather you'd be hot or cold, but if you are lukewarm, I will spew you out of my mouth".

Don't condemn God or true servents of God because of the actions of a few pretenders.You have crooks in all walks of life but all walks of life are not crooked.


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