I'm not sure what the point of your post is here.

CD Baby is one of the biggest JPF sponsors and supporters. Derek is well liked here, and I personally don't appreciate your hostile accusations on this board.

CD Baby has done so much to support the indie musician ,and I haven't heard one bad thing about them since I have been a member here and at CD Baby. In fact, I have never had checks withheld from CD Baby. You are correct that there are a number of other ways ot sell CD's; many of us support CD Baby because they provide many great resources for us, unlike other places on the net where CD's are sold.

Also, they are one of the most customer friendly companies I have ever seen. When I was setting up my account with them, they personally answered all of my questions via phone and email in a very punctual manner. I can't say enough good things about them, because I respect Derek and the company so much.

This board is a professional, friendly place, and there are probably more happy CD Baby customers and CD Baby members here than anywhere on the net. JPF members also tend to ignore these types of ridiculous requests. Your accusations aren't going to help you make friends here.

Emily

[This message has been edited by Emily Sanders (edited 08-07-2006).]

Happycamper, are you John Miller??? Or did you RECEIVE the above message from John Miller?

It's hard to take your claims seriously when the name and email address you are using here do not match the name and email address that was used to register on our site.

Secondly, you're making outrageous claims but offer zero details or facts to back them up in any way. Where's the proof and facts to support your claim? Why didn't you post them if they are true?

Third, if you have a problem with CD Baby, did you contact them to solve it? If so and you still didn't solve your problem, what was their side of the disagreement?

Fourth, in 9 years we've only heard a tiny handful of complaints about CD Baby, versus 10's of thousands of happy customers. We've never received any type of complaints that matches your statements here. In fact, just the opposite has always been true. People love the fact they get paid weekly, that they get great customer service and that CD Baby is one of the only companies in history that has paid out to their customers 6 dollars on average for every single dollar they've charged the artist. ($35 times the number of CD's on CD Baby is a little over $5 million dollars.. to date, they've paid those same artists over $30 million dollars). Find me any other music entity that charges artists for anything that has produced that much money per person in return. I am not aware of any company that's even 1 to 1, let alone 6 to 1.

And finally, your claim that you're getting closer to filing a "Class Action Lawsuit" seems absurd. I estimate at least 30K JPF members have CD's on CD Baby currently. If there was some massive uprising of complaints and problems, it seems we would have had more than your sole complaint to indicate that from 30K people.

I am not sure what your agenda is, or your perceived problem. It's always possible CD Baby has made a mistake since any company can. But to have a post with all these histrionics with no data to support it, no track record to indicate it's valid and no credibility here since the name you registered with (with "Karen" in the email) doesn't seem to match the name you signed this post with John Miller. (And the fact that you hide your email on your post to the public, but include a "yahoo" address to respond to is even more lame). If you aren't the author of that email, why would you post it here without explanation or facts to back it up?

So.. if you have any credibility.. let's hear facts and supported corroboration. If you have none, then you're simply a troll or you've been used by a troll.

Brian

That post would be the same as if against Ghandi! Yeah,,,that Ghandi,,,,,held back good wishes and discriminated against love searchers. Geezzz! Let's form a "company" (LOL)! against him!

I usually don't say this in public,,,,BUT WHAT AN IDIOT!

Hope that was loud and clear.

Derek, if you read this, somehow make his songs better so they will sell, so he can use the money to buy some brains.

John

I understand your concern. Derek is aware of this post as I sent him the link before I even responded. Apparently this idiot is spamming people all over the place with this. A search on the web brings up no website or anything other than this email. Happycamper apparently posted that email. Why she (according the registration, Happy Camper is a she) posted this without evidence or cause is the mystery. Either way, unless the attack is so vicious and full of lies and deceit that it could damage someone, we try to leave them up because in truth, they are more quickly refuted that way.

RFK said 20% of the people are against everything. In general I agree. The fact that CD Baby has a micro fraction of 1% against them should say a lot.

Everett

John Miller posted on Thu July 20, 2006

Hey,Hey,Hey
WONDERFUL TALENT!
My name is John Miller and I am the spokesperson for a company called CD BABY RIPOFF.

We are representing artists who have had money withheld from them wrongfully or been treated unfairly by CD BABY,when they had cds for sale there.

Everyday we are getting closer to being able to file a CLASS ACTION LAWSUIT against Derek Sivers and his company.
Many people have been done dirty by his company ,but were afraid to speak out.
Today there are other options besides CD BABY to sell independent cds.
If you or anyone you know has had money not paid to them,or has been discriminated against by DEREK SIVERS and CD BABY,YOUR NAME CAN BE ADDED TO OUR LIST BY SIMPLY

EMAILING-cdbabyripoff@yahoo.com.

CDBABY is not perfect, but they are full of integrety, and again I have NEVER, EVER heard of anybody not getting paid correctly and on time by them. That's not even fathomable. In fact, they just stopped their Tower deal to protect the artists from not being paid due to Tower's financial situation. And CDBABY said they would take the responsiblity to make sure everybody was paid up until this point. Which to me means they may have to cough up some of thier own money to do it. CDBABY refunded everybody's digital signup fees when it looked like things weren't getting to ITUNES correct as CDBABY first stated when digital distribution started...there are many instances, that concerning money, CDBABY has done the right thing or gone above and beyond.

Thanks for clarifying. We get people who come here and post attacks on several companies regularly using fake names and never supporting the attacks with facts (because 99.9% of the time they are false claims in the first place). So yes, we watch for those types of things very carefully. Whoever John is, he's at best a troll with an agenda.. at worst, he's simply a disgruntled competitor who can't cut it and is lashing out trying to damage CD Baby. Since there's no factual site, no factual claims and he's (assuming it's even a real person) using a lame Yahoo address that can be created in 2 minutes from anyone pretending to be anybody, it has little credibility. But when you post it on our site, it forces us to quickly react so casual surfers know we're neither agreeing nor supporting the baseless BS.

It's ALWAYS a good idea to sign your posts with your real name. If you are saying something you don't want attributed to yourself, then you may want to consider not saying it in the first place. Using your real name will often force you to think before you post and is a good self moderation technique.

You can edit the initial post to show that your were asking the question and not the author of the letter.

Welcome to Just Plain Folks. I apologize for
my strong words - but I thought you were John Miller.

Emily

Everyday we are getting closer to realizing there hasn't been a bigger butthead to come to JPF in some time. Sure, we had some spamers and the like, but harmless really, unlike the unfounded, undocumented rant of someone that might have given a wrong mailing address, or whatever the case might have been to cause a huge butthead of a knee-jerk reaction, hense the company name mentioned above.

If you want to join this company to force the butthead to list facts with names and other verification, or to appologize on all sites posted if not real claims that are accurate to his statement, just reply with a face and your name, or handle if you prefer. Just don't be a butthead and not leave a

John Daubert,
JOHN MILLER BUTTHEAD GUY "company". That, (his "company" thing) alone is rediculious.

Are there black lists anymore? Be a great time to get that new pen out and use it.

quote:

---

Originally posted by dhsongs:
I am the spokesman for a company called JOHN MILLER BUTTHEAD GUY. We are representing artists who had to read that butthead's outragious claim with no facts or artists listed, and who are defending the personable, general all around nice guy, Derek Sivers and his real company, CD Baby.

Everyday we are getting closer to realizing there hasn't been a bigger butthead to come to JPF in some time. Sure, we had some spamers and the like, but harmless really, unlike the unfounded, undocumented rant of someone that might have given a wrong mailing address, or whatever the case might have been to cause a huge butthead of a knee-jerk reaction, hense the company name mentioned above.

If you want to join this company to force the butthead to list facts with names and other verification, or to appologize on all sites posted if not real claims that are accurate to his statement, just reply with a face and your name, or handle if you prefer. Just don't be a butthead and not leave a

John Daubert,
JOHN MILLER BUTTHEAD GUY "company". That, (his "company" thing) alone is rediculious.

Are there black lists anymore? Be a great time to get that new pen out and use it.

---

John you forgot the Mike Dunbar first rule of Marketing... membership and/ or suport is designated "for" or "against" by purchasing one of your CD's...through CD Baby of course

It's a numbers game...You won't be able to please everyone.

Pat

------------------
Waltzing Through A Rock And Roll Life!!

I agree with ya. If this Post had been deleted, then a lot of us wouldn't have been able to inform ourselves about John(Butthead)Miller...And if this guy is spamming people all over the place, then what better forun than JPFolks to stand up & expose him?

I don't have a CD on CD Baby, simply because I'm not organized enough to get around to it...But I have heard nothing but good things from friends of mine who do have CD's there.

oh,,,and Hello Karen & welcome to JPFolks...& thanks for your informative(albiet slightly confusing) Post.

Midnite

quote:

---

Originally posted by Herbie Gaines:
Almost nothing should ever be deleted. It's part of the education one gets here. Properly, this person has been told "put up or shut up". It will be interesting to see if they respond. Watching the reaction to these type of things has helped me learn how to "smell a rat".

---

Wonders will never cease!

Midnite(keep the faith)Bob

P.S...& thanks for mispelling Midnite properly...:-)

Although I was born & raised in the Detroit area, I spent many years in Chicago(3 as a cab driver)...Detroit may have my soul, but Chicago has my heart,,,& my Ex-wife stole my real name, which is why I prefer to go by a name that was bestowed upon me while performing in "Chief Ike's Mambo Room" in February of 2000...And henceforth, I have been called "Midnite"...Although I will also answer to Bob...

Midnite(I know every song Steve Goodman ever wrote)Bob.

quote:

---

Originally posted by Herbie Gaines:
Hi Midnite
wow, someone actually agrees with ME? Imagine that!!!
thanks Herbie

---

the people who would claim to be ripped off by CDBaby must be the same people who tell the American idol screeners they are making a big mistake by not putting them through cause they are gonna be bigger than Elvis or Bob Dylan...

I just found this posting in a search and I just wanted to state that this person's accusations are weak at best - not to mention laughable

I worked directly with Derek behind the scenes at CD Baby for 8 years and can assure you that Derek has always paid every artist all money due them no matter what was happening. If you are a member of CD Baby, you can see that Derek accounts for every sale you make and gives you a complete rundown that you can log in and look at anytime you want. There is no conspiracy there, there are no ripoffs. If you sell a CD through CD Baby, you get paid (period).

You have no idea how hard those people are working for you 24/7 - I promise you, If you have a problem or an issue, the people at CD Baby will bend over backwards to make sure it will be cleared up.

trust me, as someone who has looked just about every CD sales site out there. You are getting a sweet bargain for your 35 bucks

as for "discrimination" ... you should meet the crew that works there. there is no way that anyone there would tolerate discrimination, let alone practice it.

Great to see you here. I've been worried about you since you left CD Baby. Send me a note off line and let me know how you're doing. jpfolkspro@aol.com.

Brian

you are correct. I was Derek's first official employee. I actually made it a point to refer employees to this link over the years

http://www.jpfolks.com/ECRoadTrip00/ECpages/cdbaby.html

just to show them what our roots were.

It still amazes me that we took it from one 8x12 office in Dereks house to a multi- warehouse operation shipping 1500 orders a day

just goes to show you what can happen when you really put yourself behind what you are doing - individuals might take issue with Derek on occasion, but I know very few people who have the stamina and the focus that he has - his business cards state that he hes "the world's longest attention span"

I believe him :-)

I had forgotten where that page was. We have so much stuff floating around on here that it's hard to keep track of.

Back at the time of those pictures we actually had more members than CD Baby. Now they're growing by like 200 people a day. We grow about 12 people a day once you count dead email addresses! hahahaa.

Let me know how you're doing out there. It's weird not having you there.

Its a comfortable feeling knowing CD baby is on our side!

And a yahoo email address that is boasting a "Class Action Lawsuit"?!.. where does this guy perform?.. I could use a few laughs.