JPF Home Page Forums Musician Gear and Techniques Guitars and Guitarist Forum Alvarez or Taylor

I was recently going back to check on my curiosities with the Taylor 900 Series Guitars and saw that in the past 3 years, the price has just gone thru the roof! I looked at my rep and said "yanno, this is pure bull****", yeah yeah I get the whole wood, body, fretboard, maker thing, but arent they gettin a little carrieed away? Is it really worth it to pay those kinna prices for the cleanest tones? NO!! He took me down the aisle and said, well, nothing. He simply handed me this Alvarez MD60, pulled up a stool, and sat me down. I played this jazzy lil riff rooted D11, D7b5, number I always play to feel out a guitar. It was immediate! I couldnt believe it! Yes the Lord has returned! Welcome to the Promised Land!!

What do you think?

Just wonderin.....

Rock Hard Rock Forever.....Tim

Well, it seems there are several factors to think about.

1. Alvarez/Yari is a mass produced instrument from Japan. Taylor is an instrument crafted in America.
2. The woods used for each instrument described are different. I don't know Alvarez's procedure for making an instrument, but I do know Taylor's. They're very specific about their wood. They have people on staff that all they do is examine and buy wood - they reject a lot of it. Plus the wood used in a 900 series might be rare at any given time so they up the price to reflect their cost. Let's also not forget the cost of making and shipping a guitar in America. The MD60 is Cedar and Mahogany. The Taylor 900 is Sitka Spruce and Indian Rosewood. There's a BIG difference in the qualities and rarity of those woods.
3. Additional feature differences: The Taylor comes with the Expression System. It can't be found on anything other than a Taylor and there is no better way to amplify an acoustic guitar than the ES system.
4. The Taylor features pearl inlays in the neck, the MD60 does not.
5. The Machine Heads for the MD60 are die-cast (meaning not the greatest quality). On the Taylor they are the Gotoh 510's much higher quality.
6. There is inlay all the way around the edge of the Taylor. The MD60 doesn't have that.
7. The Taylor comes with a custom molded guitar case. The MD60 does not.
8. The finish on a Taylor is thinner and more durable than that of the MD60. Which means it will get a better tone from the Taylor and it will take a better beating as well.

Essentially the Taylor is a higher quality instrument. If it's too costly for the 900, why not look into their more modest lines like a 400? Realize that the 900 is their high end model.

There is no reason to be complaining about the cost of a quality instrument. Taylor values their quality and workmanship and charge accordingly. If Taylors were truly overpriced no one would buy them and they would be out of business.

Me, I'm the proud owner of a 615ce. It rules.

Jody

Taylor... different strokes for different folks though...

Chuck

All I know is that I owned an Alvarez and was never crazy about it.
Never owned a Taylor. They sound pretty, though.

Taylor -- by default.

Tim:
This question comes up time to time on the Yairi Forum I belong to. Alvarez guitars are not all Yairis as not all Yairis are Alvarez. My 1970 Alvarez/Yairi 5070 is a copy of a Martin D-45 but with a 3 piece back (D-35 style)and IMHO, it can hold it's own in sound, feel and look to most guitars selling in the $2,500 - $3,000 range. Fortunately for you, because they are made in Japan, they are very undervalued so you can pick up a used one or even a new one for a very good price. I've played many a Taylor and Martin and Gibson in my days and the only ones I would trade my Yairi for would have costed me the price of a small house. I say, shop around, try them all and find yourself a soulmate

Thank you all who replied. Especially Jody. I knew I would get the breakdown on the woods and manufacturing aspects and your right. Might hafta go back again and do another sit-down with each model. My board just went too.....ugh!!! The further along I go with producing.....the more I need. It never ends, but I sure do appreciate the latest equipment as it comes out. It just keeps gettin better and better! woooohoooooo However, the price doesnt .....Pay to play....hehe

RHRF.....Tim

There are some very good guitars made in overseas factorys. When you buy a Taylor or Martin you get very good workmanship. Each Martin takes about 3 months to go thru the factory from start to finish. Each step is checked by a mastercraftsman as it advances. No doubt the same with a Taylor or Gibson.

However for the most part you can't tell the difference between a Acoustic Dreadnaught made in China or the USA. There are some refinment differences but they are small.

I have a Martin D-18 from 1961, a Gibson J-200 from 1994 both made in the U.S., and a Fender DG-7 made in Indoneisa. All have excellent sound, the Gibson not so great but acceptable.

As far as the wood, The Martin has a mahogany body, the Gibson, a Maple body, and the Fender some other wood, not sure of the type. All have spruce tops.

It is pretty impossible to mass produce an Acoustic Guitar. I visited the Martin factory in Nazerath, Pa. a few years ago. They had racks of guitars in various stages of completion. As they were advanced up the line necks and bodys were assigned matching numbers so they were not mis-matched in the final assembly.

To pick out a guitar that you like, you have to play it and compare the sounds. If the Alvarez sounds the best buy it. If you want the Taylor, or a Martin, go for it.

It is all personal taste, but I have yet to find a Taylor that does not sound very bright on the top, but very poor tone on the mid and bottom end. To me it sounds flat toned and a bit muddy down there. I fingerpick and tend to play often in the middle of the neck in the area from the 5th to 10th frets and I like strong rounded tones coming from the bottom four strings. This is specifically the area that leaves me wanting more when playing Taylors. However, they are beautifully built and have had a strong influence on how boutique builders are constructing guitars with bolt on necks. It is all a matter of what you listen for in the tone.

I have not played nearly as many Alvarez guitars, although I have heard some very beautifully toned Alvarez Yairis. The model that Steve West talks about is an outstanding guitar, but you cannot find a new one. Since it was built as a near replica of the Martin D series guitars using really good wood, they sounded not surprisingly like a Martin.

Back in the mid 1970's (I think it was 1974, but I am not certain of exact date) Steven Stills got into a bidding war with a Japanese guitar company for a 1940's era Martin D45. I think it was Alvarez Yairi that he was bidding against, but I cannot remember for sure. He wound up winning the bid at an astounding price for that time and the vintage acoustic guitar market was never the same. He wanted to prevent the Japanese company from disassembling an irreplaceable instrument so that they could duplicate it's design. Of course, he realized right after that, they would buy the next one offered and he could not keep outbidding them to keep the treasures out of the hands of a Japanese company wanting to dissect a great instrument.

I hafta say Ray and Jack, you bring up some excellent points. I agree that the wood does make the guitar, but the sound is the dead ringer. I was so surprised I guess, by the sound of the MD series, that I just got caught up in the moment of such a vast difference in price. I spend alot on my electrics (ESP mainly) but the most important factor is really how it makes me feel. I was inspired with it. And really, its been a long time since I played the Taylor. As long as it takes me where I wanna go, that to me is whats most imperative. Hell, i'll prolly end up with both of the damn things and be done with it, lol.

Tim

I've been shopping for a trade-up for my Martin 000MC. It was my first acoustic and I held out for an entry level Martin because nothing in the price range sounded even close. I've been lusting after a Taylor for several years. I love 714C but can't afford it.

The other day I was in a guitar shop, picked up a few Martins, then the Taylors and then on the way out I saw an Alvarez/Yiari. I picked it up because it was pretty. I couldn't believe the sound and the playability. For the money it was the perfect blend. Not quite, but almost the sound of the Martin, and for my hand size, actually more playable than the Taylor. This guitar has been around for some time and is an excellent buy. It is not the same as the regular Alvarezs. I would buy it over the more expensive Takamines in a skinny minute.

Hey Tim,
I posted a very similar thread back when I was looking for a new acoustic.

I wanted a Martin so bad I could taste it. But the advice I got and I think it was Jody who gave it to me, "you will know it when you play it".

And I did. I played a million too. Turned out to be a Taylor 714.

But Tim it sounds like yours turned out to be the Alvarez. Every guitar is so darn different, you got to trust your gut (and ears) on this.

Good luck,
Tom

I suppose it would be smart of me to search the archives, but I probably said that you'll have to play a lot of guitars and eventually you'll come across one and you'll know it's yours when you play it. I probably also said that you shouldn't worry about the price too. But I'll trust ya Tom. I do know that is my general advice to people looking for a guitar.

Glad to hear you found one you love. Even better it's a Taylor. :-) I love mine too, it's a 615ce.

Jody

For possible future purchase I'm playing(testing out) the Alvarez MD80, the Yamaha LL16,the Larrivee L03, and the Taylor DN3(the 310's replacement?) Similar 100% solid wood on all. Price CDN is $700, $950, $1,150, and $1,300 in that order.

I'm used to an older cheaper laminate model with not near the balance tone and sustain of the above....so any one of them is a HUGH step forward.

The best sounding one to me? I'll keep them in the same order believe it or not. THe Taylor just edged out the larrivee.

But so little time and so many guitars.

The money should be a secondary consideration. Get a loan. Like a house mortgage concept...a lifetime concept!

I read somewhere we live in a golden age of guitars, probably because of the 60's revolver.

HMMM...about that larrivee SD50 with the wide nut...$2,000...hmmm

Bill