JPF Home Page Forums General Messages General Message Forum New Forums??

I did and alll I saw was North America, North America North America and a lil more North America, is that the whole music industry?? did you look at the charts across the globe?? Concert tour?? did you mean one artist T.S. who pretty much owns alll the above mentioned. made more then Whacken in germany? Or how about Ozzfests?? maybe the Glotsenbury festival or however you spell it?? Lets leave Nashville for a sec. even so. do you think new york or L.A. agree?? Besides all that I am still just trying to make more room for things other then country. We push away lots just from the "grassroots" in the main home page. does that look like a country site ora music site?

I think this site will die with all of you without looking for change to the future. If there is no one around my age say in ten years do you think this site will still be useful?

Try and keep up here, you missed my point 100%. Variety is what I am talking about, not musical styles. I think I am pretty much done on this conversation -- it is really no use.

Kevin

I dint really you said you like JPF cuz it seems like 69 radio with all diffrent stuff jammed together. The world dosent listen to 69 radio anymore I think you missed what I was saying

Aaron
I'm not sure where you have been but take a look at the membership of this organization. Have you looked at the JPF music awards?
There are people from all over the globe in a score of Genres represented there. I was in Nashville for the awards and it was a standing room only crowd. And it was a very big venue. The age range was teenagers to very old.. like me.

This organization has done very well just as is and it is still growing.
If Brian believes it needs more Genre forums he will add them but I tend to agree with his assessment. Young people don't spend much time here anyway. And they certainly are not discouraged.
But they do come here. Some stay some leave.
It may have a little to do with the thickness of their skin.

Hey Bill yeah I know about the org. I did look at all the different genres and the different countries involved and such but you will notice outside of the US not to much made it in the country part. JPF is the biggest awards going I know the chapters will do a lot better then this site which to me sounds backwards. You got me on the part that some stay some leave but I want to be able to keep more to stay then leave which I dont think is happening.

Seems to me that Aaron is just trying to breathe some life into a corpse, and also provide some diversity.

Keep goin Aaron ! If you try electric schock therapy next, that may put a jolt down the spines of the fossils, heck,.... they may even become animated, which is close enough to breathing, anyways.

cheers, niteshift

Aaron, you are trying to pick fights where there is none here. You are missing the point of what everyone is trying to tell you. There is plenty of variety here. Nashville is of interest to many writers who aren't artists because it is nearly the last place you can get material considered if you are not an artist.
Most other music is self contained so there are no outside cuts.

Artists rarely have interest in places like this because they are being artists. And yes, this site will probably continue on with or without you, me or anybody. You need to get outside yourself and gain a little common sense. This is not about you. this is about sharing information and various processes all over. There are different places.

And no I don't think LA and New York agree. I just left a party with half of the people FROM LA and New York coming here. They do it all the time. Do we all try to break into the Canadian market? Nope. Don't have to. They all come here. Last week I worked with two people from Manitoba. I work with Canadians all the time, who come here. So get off the "Hey dude their is other music...' garbage. I know it. I deal with people on a daily basis coming from those areas because it doesn't work for them.
I make no apologies for being in Nashville. People come to me, I don't go to them. I give one of several Nashville opinions here. There are also people from the UK, Austrailia, the Netherlands, Denmark, Canada, and most of the states. In case you want to find out, just read the people who posts profiles.

Now you can have your own forums or your own whatever. Start your own web site, come here in addition or do whatever works for you. But stop denigrating other people that don't fall in line behind you.I have watched you in the last couple of weeks make very rude and arrogant comments to Big Jim, who I don't agree with on everything but I do respect his opinion. You acted very arrogant to him and that was not cool. The same with making dissmissive comments to others. Get a grip.

No one has denigrated you or said you can't do whatever you want. But there is an expense involved and there is a lack of interest in many cases. Much of this stuff has been tried by other people. You are not the first to this site. Neither am I. And they will do fine with or without us.

So calm down a little, listen to other people, understand what they intend, respect their feelings and do your own things without the attitude.

It helps everybody.

MAB

Hmmmm... ever feel invisible on your own message board?

Aaron take a look at our slogan.......We encourage people from all walks of life and from all kinds of music to join in and participate. It does not matter what music you like or where you are from or how old you are there is a place for you here.
You say that kids are not interested unless it is hip and the music being discussed is relevant to them. There are plenty of sites where that happens. That said I am sure that any kids coming on here will gain hugely from the help and knowledge us old farts give them. I bet we could give kids a good run for their money with our talent and experience and by exchanging ideas it is just possible we might learn from you.

Who said that?

What are you doing up at 5 A.M? You are supposed to be resting.

We have mega talented, multi award winning youngster Andrew Aversa who mostly does techno/electronic music and who has always been welcomed, encouraged and supported by everyone here. If someone cruises in and finds something specific lacking, I'd like to know what it is. We have hit writers, Grammy, Emmy, Tony and Oscar winners who post here and are always happy to answer a relevant question. We have a community that will bend over backwards to support members in all sorts of ways. The young folks who have come here and stayed involved have all benefited significantly. If they are too "ageist" to accept free no strings help from people who have achieved every possible level of success and shared that knowledge, support and help and educated many in the community who are here daily and treat each other like a real family, then frankly there is no loss in not having them here. They aren't ready to be helped and they aren't interested in being part of the most sincere and caring music community in the world.

That said, this is still my board and arguments to change it are pointless if I am not part of the talk. I've offered some conditions with little response as if I am invisible on the topic.

Thanks to those who have injected respectful discourse, thanks!

Brian

Hope you are feeling better Brian. Would be kind of nice to hear how everyone is doing, Mike Cairo, Big Jim, etc. that have had recent health problems.

Hope you are all well.

MAB

People will come and go all the time. I have been here about 3+ years or so and in that time I think a) 10 new boards have been added, based on user requests (Success Stories, we're all in this together, Creative Writing, Challenges, Cooking.....) b) the site has gone under a major overhaul in look and feel, c) forums have been re-arranged to allow better access.

Change is occurring all the time. I am not opposed to change, but I haven't heard any good reasoning yet to split up the MP3 boards into 1) old fart music and 2) young and hip people music. I think if you could guarantee an infusion of young people flocking to this site, then Brian would do whatever it would take. But you can't and your analysis of the MP3 board is incorrect. Right now out of the first 20 posts, I would say that 6-8 are "country" and the rest are not.

There is plenty of room for new blood, but splitting up the MP3 board into genres doesn't sound like a recipe for success to me. Of course, I am not the one you need to convince.

Kevin

Thanks Marc for your thoughts. Speaking only for myself..... I am fine still a wee bit sore and will probably have to have another back op...BUT nothing serious. As for Brian well he should be resting up...but we all know that a couple of strokes is not going to stop him being active. Mike is still active on the boards and doing what he can music wise but he has had and still is having a terrible time health wise. I wish them both all the best and hope their luck changes.

Jim,

Glad to hear it. I don't know how any of you do it. I work with music and songwriters all day and into the night and am so wiped out I cannot fathom how it would be to try and do that and have serious health problems. So the fact that all of you are here and still participate is amazing to me. Very inspirational and underlines how unique this community is.

On the timelines and life of most web sites and parts of these type sites. There is always change. Change in music, change in styles, change in artists, change in writers. The only thing consistant in life is change. One of my points I always try to make is that relatvily the same comments and complaints about everything from life to music to whatever, are virtually the same throughout history. I always say there will probably one day be a discovery of a cave drawing with some Cave dad telling his Cave son, about how music was "back in his day."

It is easy to think we are the only ones involved. One of the mistakes I see writers make constantly is the fact that they never see the enormity of how many people are trying to be involved in music in some way shape or form. Literally millions of people. And there are sites for just about everyone on the Internet, just like music, you gotta go find them.

The life span of most writers, artists, musicians, are that when they are young, (16-30) they are busy trying to be artists, writers, etc. They also are just learning about life and usually have many intersests. As they get older and gain more experience, they tend to calm down and want to learn more than talk all the time. They realize they actually don't know it all, and that many things they thought were one way are actually very far from it.

We have all gone through that. We have had dealings where our "Perfect song" was shot down in flames. People talk over our songs in clubs, life gets in the way and bills and kids take precidence in what we do.

At that time, most writers turn to the internet because it is the most accessable. Right there 24 hours a day and you can do it in your underwear.

Most writers who are at that stage, over thirty, not artists, or just plain worn out, come to places like these. The other underlining factor is that most writers here are not present artists. I know I am not. I am WAY past my prime. But I write with literally hundreds of artists worldwide, working with their ideas, emotions and cultures. So I have to remain somewhat aware of various styles, attitudes etc.

Most of us come here to share info, experiences and relate to others who are like us. We are lucky enough to have a forum to do that. It is quite frankly, very cool.

So I hope none of us abuse that. We should be grateful for the opportunity to interact and always try to further each other's understanding. Even when we dissagree, it is pretty interesting.

MAB

Well Aaron, We have Talented Members of every avenue in life and then you have me. What more can you ask? Oh, I forgot Kevin and Kevin.

I'm supposed to be playing in the dirt and then I made the mistake of looking at this cotton pickin' thread <G>

I'll just add, though it has probably already been noted, that this is primarily, far as I know, I SONGWRITERS SITE.
The last I heard, Country was by far the easiest genre for an "outside" writer to get anything accepted into. If Brian or someone else knows better than that, I'm all "Ears", (Well, there "is" my "Nose" <G>).

Quite a few, even maybe "most" of the other genres are very difficult to get anything accepted. They write their "Own" stuff.
Country is tough enough.
Therefore--henceforth and other words like that, it makes "Sense" for a songwriters site to be more country than anything else.
We have a lot of artists here too and you can probably get something that they'll use but I'm talking about "Commercial"stuff, you know --big time $$$ all that.

NOW!!! I'm not looking at this dang thread till the sun sinks in the west <G>
You all carry on in my abscene(I don't think that's spelled right <G>)
Wy

Ok whatever I will shut up now it is getting nowhere. I am not picking fights, I saw a diamond in the rough of a site that had so much potential cuz of the 50'000 members, thats a huge bargining chip for advertisers. Thats about as commercial as I was thinking. If everyone was a superstar or all the songwriters that had talent got their cut, everyone in the business would be outta biz. Nothing I say is acknowledged as it should be you guys think I am just here to challenge you guys or something which is not the case at all. If this wasn't on a computer and we were face to face this would be a way different convo.

Brian
You were not invisible at all I saw what you laid out for me/us to do to get it done. I was only trying to say its pretty hard to show support on it if its not already there but I was being side tracked by everyone who is opposed to it.


Thanks Night and everyone who has already supported the idea.

Brian

Have you ever though about using Joomla or something like it?

Aaron,

No one is telling you to shut up. You have got to quit being so defensive. You are pretty new here so probably a little back story might be in order.

Just Plain Folks has been around for quite some time. There are not nessasarily 50,000 members all at one time. That is over a period of time. Some come around then go away, most don't even visit the forums much, very few have continuous discussions or even post. Some have joined through friends or other areas,when their CD's are submitted for the awards or other contests. I have known a lot of artists who have been members and didn't even know they were members. Their CD might have been submitted by another member of their band, publishing company etc.

What has developed here is a fairly small group of the overall site. There are member workshops around the world and they participate sometimes, sometimes don't participate at all. So when you start adding all these things a lot of things tend to dissapate. If you keep things mostly together it builds more people and that builds more interest.

Most of the writers here are not performers or might not be in the mainstream of performing. They are in different cities, countries, towns and this forum along with others are a way to keep in touch with friends and share opinions and information from the various areas around the world. People in other countries who might be interested in the States often particpate here because it provides them a bridge to wherever they are going.

You hear of a more Nashville or country componant here because almost all other types of music, rock, folk, blues, world, rap, hip hop, etc. are self contained, meaning outside the immediate artist's circle, producer, publishing company, lawyers, managers, etc. there are no outside cuts. So writing that type of material for the most part is futile because it is not even accepted. This is a trend that was started mostly by rock artists like Buddy Holly and the Beatles and have just continued along that since then.

Country has now taken up that trend with the prevalance for artists to write their own material happening about 92% of the time. So many of the writers either have some personal contact or are working on developing relationships with Nashville where the sense of community is more compact and managable than LA or New York have. Which is why so many writers and artists from LA, New York, Toronto, England, and other countries come here.

On your comments about the rest of the world, and the lack of American country music, there are several reasons for that, one of which is many countries, Canada included, have protectionist policies about how much foreign content is allowed into the country. Canada has a 70% Canadian content, which is why not that much is allowed into the country. Same with many European countries.

There are also not as much centralized booking agencies, record companies, etc. and many things change within the laws of each country. So it is actually harder to get American music in other areas. But many of the people we deal with here are coming here to interact within the American market. That is not being superior, just the way it has been. The same as the Beatles were always trying to get to America and exploded world wide when they got here.
With the Internet that is not as prelevant now but still many countries, and particularly artists and writers tend to come here if not to have careers here as much as to "soak up" craft and technical information. And as I say, the community of writers and artists here are simply more compact which is why everyone seems to know every one else.

As far as opening doors for other forums, there is not that much problems with that so much as when it has been tried before, it has not worked out very well. As I said before, a lot of younger people such as yourself don't really participate in things like this. So it would have the effect of limiting the things most of the people are interested in, in order to facilitate a few that might or might not participate.

Bryan has to look out for the overall health of the site and respond to the majority demand going on. People who post a good bit here, such as myself have their own reasons and interests. For me personally, the entire reason I am here is to stay in touch with friends I have made over the years who have been members here. Since my actual business is involved in things a majority of these people are interested in, and since many are trying to come into my neighborhood, I comment and share Nashville perspective in order to help them focus their time and more effectively spend their money more efficiently.

That is why you hear the Nashville and country music perspective
more often than some other perspectives.

MAB

Aaron, it may be time to focus on songwriting, or performing, or recording, and have this topic be more of a side topic now. Most of the 51000 members will never be on the boards anyhow. Many just became members to enter the awards. So, if you see any of those "members", please ask them, as have been, to at least visit the boards.

Johnny

Actually, over the years, we've gained the most members via Roadtrips and the desire to perform at a showcase. The awards only happen bi-annually so though we do get most of our International members that way (and frankly I would do the awards for that reason alone since we have no other way to really reach those folks, especially in diverse genres).

If Aaron really wants to help JPF he needs to do so from within. If he doesn't want to become part of the existing family, then it's just words. JPF does wield a lot of power for a grassroots entity. We are regularly the "go to" source for major political battles supporting writer and artist rights to represent the grassroots community. Our awards are the largest in the world and give many deserving (and amazing) artists and writers the most unbiased and sincere acknowledgement possible (which is what the true purpose of awards are for right?). Many awards have become calculated sales tools for commerce. That's fine to a point, but I like our approach better. For me, both of those are better approaches than simply doing it to make a buck. For me, that serves primarily the owners of the awards/contests and I think those goals often over-ride the real mission. We have intentionally avoided advertising except from the sources we personally endorse fully. And we are VERY picky when it comes to that. In my opinion that is no small thing. Few if any other entities are as careful with who we endorse. We also are among the best places to check out just about any company or deal to see if it's good, bad or ugly. We've exposed tons of long time scam artists and put some totally out of business. They threaten us often, but the truth is a 100% defense in court and they know it.

In addition, I have met over 25,000 of our 50,000 members face to face in their own hometown (i.e. it wasn't just an audience at an event), I have lived among our members directly and have dozens of surrogate families around North America because my frequent tours allowed me to become like a visiting cousin or uncle. So no offense to John and Marc, but our 50K members are more connected than they realize. By the way, we don't even count many folks in that 50K. For example, unless someone chooses to sign up for our newsletter and maintain an active account, they aren't even considered officially as JPF members. (DonnaMarilyn learned that this morning as she was never signed up and those folks have little access to what else might be going on with JPF).

Right now JPF is unfortunately in a holding pattern where very little is going on. My health troubles are to blame. But we are getting ready to exlode things again. We have a new awards process coming up, we have a new outreach program that I think is unique in our business and we're going to start agressively reaching out to the 50K members on the email list as well as the 18K registered on these boards (and maybe even the 30K additional folks who have wandered off over the years) PLUS the band members who aren't even counted in our numbers (i.e. a band or symphony count as 1 member.. we want to reach out to all of them) and increase their involvement. We also plan to relaunch many of our Chapters which I have always believed are the single best tool to build real and lasting professional and personal friendships and the best way to help local music communities. all of this combined should represent our 2010-2011 strategies (with a few surprises I have saved up). If Aaron wants to see JPF thrive, there's plenty of work to be done.

As for our message boards, in a way they are a musician/songwriter's facebook. Only in our case, we predate the entire social network movement by many years. The first incarnation of Just Plain Folks turns 25 years old this month. = )

Brian

Wow, we are old! well I guess seasoned would be better....:)

Well spoken Brian!!
You "Do" have a way with words!!
Take that you miscreants!! (You "Other" miscreants?, Well whatever<G>)

Howsomever, I might add, so many folks seem to take things so "Seriously"--Name calling and denigrating(Is that spelled right Donna? <G>)---and all. Lighten up guys!!--Live, Laugh, Love!!---("I'm writing the song--Hands off!!)
Life is short and time is fleeting!!
Gotta plant maters
Y'all carry on
Wy
(Seasoned is good Kathy. BOY!! am I well seasoned!!)

Hey Brain

You are a true champion thats for sure. I am down and I will help out as much as possible pretty stoked on it really no matter what direction it takes this is still an amazing thing you have built up here. Whatever you need I will do my very best to help out. Thanx Brian

As for a chat room, I believe I may have a solution. Namely ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IRC ). I'm at a server that is mostly stable, and it would be great if we could have a dedicated room to us there. The server I call home is www.esper.net , and it's run by a great group of guys.

If you want me to, I can create the room for y'all. As for clients, I reccomend HydraIRC.