JPF Home Page Forums General Messages General Message Forum Any artists here use a booking agency?

Our duo is playing more and more, gaining fans, and able to command a little more money in our regional venues. But we are also business owners (two small retail businesses and a small screenprinting shop) so that makes booking and marketing another job. I'm exhausted. LOL I've wondered about what a booking agency could do for us. I have absolutely no experience with them... what kind of pay (percentages?) do they take? Do they do promotion as well? We're starting to look at opportunities outside of our immediate area where we have no contacts, so perhaps an agent could help us with that? Noob questions here, I know, but anyone have experiences to share?

Duke,

You may find that it is harder than you think to get an agent interested in a duo. By definition, duos don't have as large a reach as a full band and the money agents can get out of gigs don't cover the costs of their involvement. Most won't work with duos or solos just because they can't command enough money.

They work on a percentage and spending hundreds of dollars and time on phone calls, networking, emails, and other tools, to get 15-25% of someone making under $300 for a show is just not worth it. There are not even as many agents as there used to be as venues have downsized in what they pay.

You can ask around, but this was a big issue about ten years ago when agents started dropping out of the business, and I am pretty sure it has not gotten any better.

The main thing you can do is get a Google search on Agents in your region and talk to them. What has dissapeared over the years are the "middle men." The people who used to roadie, engineer sessions, drive trucks and buses, sell merchandise, agents, managers, etc. as money has decreased overall and the cost of doing business has gone up, venues dissapearing altogether, we have all become lighter, tighter and more self contained. You could also contact some people doing what you are wanting to do and find out what they do.

Most people are doing very similar to what you are. Working other jobs AND doing the booking and all the details themselves. Like everything else, just a cost of doing business in this era.

MAB

Thanks! That's what I had thought, but another reason I asked is that a lot of local bands have asked me about being their promoter. We do a pretty good job of it (relatively speaking) in our area, and some great local bands really suck at it. LOL They don't do social media at all or not very well, not good at contacting places, or getting a crowd out. Of course, I barely have time for all that I'm doing now, but it's a thought for the future.

It's all about allocation of time. Bands, duos, singles, etc. spend as much of their time on social media as they do on rehearsing, writing, etc. It is an enormous outlay of time and that is why most people don't want to do it. But it is the reality of today's music industry. WE are all having to wear a lot of extra hats.

And at the end of it, a lot of time, the money we are making is barely worth us even being out there. Again, the Internet has put so many people into the game, it has taken most of the money out of the game. Venues can get some new kids out of college who are great on social media, and pay them almost nothing. The old pros can barely even keep up.

Venues are under assault from liability insurance, increased competition, government regulations, and just plain a downturn in the economy. Is the same in all businesses now. They have already gone through their version of "Automation." It is called "KARAOKE." Get rid of the professionals, make the drunk audience the entertainment, and lower the costs. And ASCAP, BMI and SESAC don't help by suing venues for licencing fees. Everywhere I go artists are talking about having no gigs because their old standbys have gone out of business or stopped live music.

So the booking agents have been eliminated as a cost of doing business. Another thing you asked about "do they do promotion?" Rarely. They are responsible for booking only. Promoters are responsible for promotion. And until you are making a ton of money, that is YOU.

A do it yourself world.

MAB

My experience here in Florida is the same as Marc's. There are a couple of agencies but they are very focused on certain large venues and certain genres. I have never been able to get one interested in my band.

As far as being a promoter is concerned, it is a job that requires a salesman's persistence and desire to talk on the phone all the time to people who don't really want what he is selling and are often jerks to boot. Doing the on-line stuff is pretty straightforward but can be time consuming and I can't imagine anyone who is not in the big time spending a lot on it.

Having said that, there is probably a niche if you can get some serious up and coming people as clients.

Back in the day, my band was booked through East Coast Entertainment. They generally took about 15% but they were able to book gigs and promote us way beyond what we would have been able to do ourselves. Unless the business has radically changed in the last decade, a GOOD booking agency is a must. Even for local gigs when I was in a local cover band, you just wouldn't get into certain clubs unless you went through one of the big (in some cases just one) of the predominant agencies in that area. It certainly can't hurt. If you are good, the more you play the better things generally get including the pay. It is certainly worth the standard 15% if you are playing more dates and building an audience and recognition. It doesn't matter if you are making $300 or $1500 per gig, imo it is money well spent (yeah, I know agencies are blood suckers sometimes but you gotta pay the dues).

Peace,
TC

This is interesting information. There is a booking agent here in NH that all of the nice restaurants sign onto and they do all of the bookings for those venues, to relieve the restaurant owners of planning music and dealing with artists, they pay the booking agent and then pay the artist after their gig. No one can play at those restaurants if they aren't with the booking agency. I have many friends signed up with the same agency and they take mostly individual and duos because the restaurants can't handle large bands.

It is only worth having a booking agent (on either side) if you have a significant national following and can play medium to large venues frequented by non major label national acts with radio support. If you can't bring in people in at least 10 large markets to sell 100 tickets per, it would be hard to find an agent who could afford to have you as a client. Imagine making 20% as an agent which would be $200 per show... that may not even be break even for them. You'd be better off establish a circular pattern around your location and finding/building/maintaining relationships with 2 venues (on opposite sides of town from each other) in 10 different cities around you within a back-and-forth overnight driving range. When you can bring out over 100 ticket buyers in those 10 cities everyone month, then you might be able to find an agent to expand your reach and upsize your venues, working with your marketing efforts to do so. You may be able to open for hot regional bands, some older national touring bands with mid sized/venue audiences etc. It's all really just a part of methodical building of your fanbase and relationships with venues and markets. It's also smart to plan in at least one high paying gigs in each large market to support you doing shows in smaller satellite venues while you build new fans. It also depends greatly on your talent, live performance show and energy and what types of fan bases you attract as well as genre and material (original, covers, etc.) A lot of variables to consider, but for a duo with day jobs, you're far better off doing it yourself, finding an intern to help you (or even one of your young company employees who may into music and who would love to spend an hour of their workday helping your band). I could go on and on, but you get the idea.

Perfectly laid out Brian. And also one of the reasons music is a younger person's game. It takes HOURS a day on social media just to maintain all those connections, bookings, building fan base. Most people with jobs simply don't have time for it. And as we age, we don't go out that much, and particularly to hear music. Even those of us IN the music business, rarely go out to just hear music. WE deal with it all day, therefore it's one of the LAST things we want to deal with at night.

Younger people who go out, stay out late, are the ones who fuel the market, so aging singles and duos, are usually pushed out of the market. One of the things you are talking about, Tams, is with those booking agents you discuss, they usually have fairly tight rosters, they don't want their own people competing with their other people. They'll have a very specific roster list, a certain amount of singles, certain duos, certain combos and certain bands, for the application they need. Most of those have been in the region for years and decades and have large fan base built up. Actually they all were doing everything themselves until they could get someone to take over the job.

I have been to New Hampshire and one of the complaints that a lot of the local artists had were that there were limited venues and opportunities in their area. And NO money for them to make. And that is what it is all about. If you can help generate income, patrons, and activity for a resturant, bar, winery, festival, concert, etc. Then your demand goes up and the booking agents find YOU.

For most of us, it is going to constantly be booking ourselves, doing it all, wearing a lot of hats. In more than most cases, there is simply not enough money involved to do it any other way.

And yes, TC, the business has changed RADICALLY. There are ENORMOUSLY MORE PEOPLE TRYING TO DO THIS. The Internet has made everyone THINK they are a singer, a writer, an entertainer. That is why there is so many Karaoke and non professional nights, open mics, talent contests, etc. The demand for professional musicians have plummeted through the basement while the the supply of people willing to play for nothing or tips, have shot through the roof.

There are hundreds of thousands of kids in and graduating from college, who are going to bring their beer buddies out to see them and they are going to play for tips. And the older "hit bands, duos, etc. from yesteryear, are actually playing the larger higher paying club gigs where once was the "training ground" for the big time. There are things like Casinos, which can get the top entertainment that the older people with income would go see.

The middle class has been squeezed out, just like the rest of life.

So it is an intensely different world than three, five or ten years ago and growing expotentialy so. But having said that, there are always new people that break through in finding their own niche. The outline Brian just did is pretty much on track. You have to build interest and action in your BRAND BEFORE any agency, manager, investor, venue, will be interested in you in the first place.

MAB