JPF Home Page Forums General Messages Musician Message Forum Time Signatures

Andrew, thanks! Is that how some come up with these strange time signatures...is by "adding" up a particular string of measures or phrases of words.?

Hey Sharon
Thanks for the welcome.
Cathy

Well, yeah. It all boils down to adding fractions.

5/4 is usually broken down into a 3/4 and a 2/4, or vice versa. 7/4 is often rendered as 4/4 and 3/4, and so on. I usually count a 9/8 to myself just by doing a really slow 3/4 with triplets on each beat.

Getting familiar with weird time signatures--and with music that seamlessly incorporates time changes--makes writing an interesting song so much easier. Perhaps the best example of a writer who incorporates time changes and odd time signatures into very "pop/rock" style music--ie, without calling attention to the time changes, as progressive rock usually does--is Jason Robert Brown. (Particularly "She Cries," "See I'm Smiling," "The Next Ten Minutes," and "Thirteen). Joni Mitchell's later work also does this brilliantlyTechniques such as hemiola are also a great way to switch up rhythms--staying in the same time signature, but articulating and accenting as if you're in another. Nothing really bugs me so much with musicians as when the beat obviously wants to vary and they keep playing straight because they don't know how to do otherwise.

Also, listening to a lot of nice latin music can help--they like to switch between 6/8 and 3/4 a lot ("America" from West Side Story is a perfect example of this). It creates the sense of a constant beat--very danceable music--while still shaking things up enough to keep things interesting.

Thank you Andrew for more information on how good musicians use various time signatures....reminds me of a demo I had done a few years ago....the initial time signature was a good waltz and to make things interesting we came back with an overlay of 6/8 timing.....the song actually turned out to be ideal for ice dancing of all things!

You're very welcome, Cathy!

Andrew, BTW, fractions were always a pain in the neck for me in the math equations. LOL

Pink Floyd - "Money" (7/4)
"Strawberry Fields Forever" has just 4 measures of 3/4 snuck into the song (listen to the chorus). The rest is 4/4.

But yeah, sigs are tricky things.

I always thought I heard that same thing on "Brain Damage" and "Eclipse", the final 2 tracks from that same album.

Pink floyd from the start has Beatles written all over them.

Matt

Dear Sharon How beautiful it is to see your name on the boards again... Several of us went a looking for you...and all
were glad when JeanB...found you safe and....feeling better.

I'm just coming by to say hi... I do not believe I've advanced any in the music theory area...since you left..but do continue to write as much as time will allow me.....

very best to you...Sharon..with a big welcome back hug....
Kaley....


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Kaley! Thanks for the stopover....and many thanks for the kindnesses you all have show with concern....I was too sick to really get much of anything done....but I'm on a definite new road now and surpisingly am using more music theory now then songwriting....but it seems to feel more right for me....I have always thought so much of your songwriting and have found you so unique in what you do do. Thanks a million again...Love amd the best of wishes...

Thanks for the comment...sometimes when I see a song with a time signature change in the middle of the song....I can't help but think of the old saying of the cart before the horse or vice a versa/// ha ha Thanks again

Thank you, Matt for the contribution to the interesting time signature education here.....this has turned out to be such a great educational topic....I've learned a lot....think I'll be like Mike and say a great "aha!"

This is a useful post.. thought I'd refresh it a bit.

Brian

I think the first time I because aware of the creative possibilities of time signatures was when I first heard the Beatles do "We can work it out" And Mike D, thanks for the explanation of bubbas and babaloos- that makes it simple to understand.

Twelve Days Of Christmas sheet music is an interesting bit of reading in this regard also.
Graham

Jazz trumpeter Don Ellis is known for his use of unusual time signatures as well as playing a quarter tone trumpet.
Unfortunately he died in 1978 but he wrote & recorded some amazing music. He wrote in rhythmic time signatures using numerators of 11, 19, 25, 33.