Originally Posted by Michael Zaneski
Originally Posted by Fdemetrio
Originally Posted by Michael Zaneski
Originally Posted by Fdemetrio
Gavin, Kevin, Mike, Liberals.....

Martin, Couchgrouch, Ray, Sue, Conservatives....

Am i wrong? You know how id know even if I didnt know? By what they say about Global Warming

Isnt that a bit like why 66% of blacks thought OJ was innocent but 66% of Whites thought he was guilty...it was ALMOST as easy as looking at the color of ones skin and knowing what they thought about it.

Shrugs...


FD,

Actually, climate change is uniting both parties, in essence, but not in it's urgency.

A majority of Republicans now DO believe climate change is a reality. It's just an overwhelming majority that, when polled, think it's not a big deal at this time..It's a much smaller percentage of Republicans that believe it to be a hoax or conspiracy.

https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2017/12/14/climate/republicans-global-warming-maps.html

Of course, I am sure "alternative facts" can be found to support anything at this point.

That's why everything boils down to a leap of faith. Doublespeak can find a way to make us believe the most obvious scientific facts are "fake facts."





Well, so far anybody here with identifiable political leanings have supported my theory. I dont think most people believe climate change is real, what I do believe is people believe or disbelieve based on what source tells them. If you only watch fox news, guess what your opinion will be, if you only watch cnn guess as well.

No matter what side you take, we dont realize that our "sides" are so biased. I know Dems who will vote Dem no matter what the situation is. I also know Repubs who do the same. Whether its good for the country or not, whether the candidate is a murderer, felon, predator, none of that matters, they vote their party no matter what.

Cant tell you how un American that actually is, and how stupid it actually is.

I also think we need more than two points of view, last election I thought both Trump and Hillary were jokes of candidates. I was saying in the entire country we cant find two better candidates than that?

How this applies to Global Warming..... As I wrote, I can tell what party the person belongs to just by how they feel about Global Warming

I say its a scientific question that educated scientists should be debating. Once they figure it out, then lets go for legislation, lets not let our politicians decide if its real or not.

We might as well let politicians write and record our music for us too.

I agree spin and doublespeak can change many opinions. That's why I say lets let the scientists figure it out. Lets make it a proven fact, and then try to find a solution.

As I wrote, we dont even have "proof" that a high fat diet is bad for you, many think it's good for you, educated Harvard and Yale Scientists are still debating this

Here is what we already know. Obesity, way bigger problem RIGHT now than Global Warming. https://www.endocrineweb.com/conditions/obesity/obesity-america-growing-concern.

Health Care is going to bankrupt us before we could even figure out a way to change Climate.

Gun Violence is getting so bad, all of our children will be shot at school before they figure out if climate change is hurting us

If Im a presidential candidate, I dont even mention Global Warming, not till the more important stuff is brought up.






Hi FD,

I can understand your frustration.

And I like how you put things, that climate change may be important, but certainly not as important as health care, gun violence, etc. at the present time..

It's a chicken/egg thing..do we choose to watch CNN or Fox News because we want to hear agreement about the things we already believe..or do watch CNN or Fox News because we perhaps unintentionally are allowing them to fill our heads with their stances towards issues that we have no clear opinions on before watching...

I'm sure there are liberals that watch Fox News and conservatives that watch CNN. Mainly cuz many folks love to "hate watch."

But your point is taken..

I know for myself and many artists who really stay away from most news sources end up either hunting information down for themselves, but do get skeptical if it's a sketchy source..or..we look at other people and choose which "side" we are on based on who we think has the facts and speaks the truth, and then backwards engineer from that. This latter method pretty much goes along with what you were saying, and I'm not proud of the fact that some of my "beliefs" are not very well informed and that I have looked at people and made decisions based on who I simply "liked" and believed were speaking the truth..

I mean, unless we choose to major in climatology at university, aren't we all, to some degree, putting our faith in other sources of information? Leap of faith..

And I think the worse offense is that some folks can glean a few facts about a subject and think they are well-informed. There's a LOT of that these days. Thanks, Internet!

As far as climate change goes..I also am not very well informed, but take a "leap of faith" as we must do with most issues..that there are people who know better than me, and that a shortcut to knowing stuff first-hand which can be time consuming (and still involves a leap-of-faith as to authenticity of the facts and source of the facts) can be to figure who the truth speaking voices are..and I am sure those that fancy themselves "conservatives" find a different source they find to be speaking the truth. Daunting and perplexing stuff..what came first my proir beliefs which I then seek out like-minded sources, or sources who I simply identify with and choose to let them inform my opinions..chicken..egg..

I know most of us want to believe we are hunters of information and are totally in control and in charge of what we believe, not the other way around..but your posts have made me think about that..so thanks for that..

But this chicken egg conundrum.. I don't think we can ever know, cuz at root it's a deep philosophical problem, along the lines of "do we really have free will" and "can we really experience anything objectively?"

Side note.. I noticed you lumped Marty in with conservatives cuz he took the same stance as Rob, 90dB, Tony, etc..But Marty clearly stated that he hasn't formed a solid opinion because he's not very well informed on the subject of climate change. So you can't lump him in and say you can guess his idealogy based on his climate-change-stance. And every "conservative" here has a slightly different stance. SOme believe it's a hoax or a religion or not real, while others think it's real, but just not so important. SO polling us locally on this issue would really show no clear division along ideaological lines, and that is no different than the Nation-wide polls..But as to urgency, there's the rub. There's where a clear division is apparent.

Mike



Yea there are still individual thoughts, and that's a good thing. But the fact that i'm able to know who leans which way, has alot to do with what they say about issues.

It's a science question, plain and simple, yet it's a democrat and republican, liberal/conservative issue for reasons not fully understood.

I mentioned earlier, Galileo was placed on house arrest for stating the Earth orbited the Sun. The Catholic church called it blasphemy because if the Earth revolves around the sun, it's not any more special than any other planet, and this conflicted with the teaching of the church.

Point being, it shouldnt have been a religious or legal issue at all, it was a science issue, and science won in the end. No denying today he was right.

Btw, the Church has executed many such people, all in the name of God!

Imagine they had that power today? Who would they execute on the Global Warming issue? It would have been thought the warming was caused by God, and anybody who suggested otherwise would be in trouble.

My personal belief is God somehow was involved in creation, but he doesnt interfere, it's pretty clear he runs an open ended world. That doesnt dismiss Him in my view.

Also have to figure out by what we mean by God too.




Last edited by Fdemetrio; 09/24/19 05:28 PM.